Who's the most succesful green woodworker you know?

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Re: Who's the most succesful green woodworker you know?

Postby ToneWood » Sat Jun 23, 2012 4:33 pm

witt wrote:...Silence is not bad. In fact, it's just the death of the ego. Some of the most venerable death, surely.
Isn't the elimination of self/ego (& altruism) what Buddhism teaches - aiming ultimately for Nirvana? (Sorry, I didn't follow the rest of it - I'm not a philosopher.) The Dalai Lama is in the UK at the moment, the Buddhist monks strike me as unusually happy/content looking people. Perhaps there is something worthwhile to be learnt there?

Going back to the original post:
Chris Amey wrote:...But who is out there making a pretty penny actually selling their product?

I doubt if making a pretty penny was the goal of most green wood workers. They need to survive, make a living and, hopefully, prosper. But if wealth was what interested them most, they'd likely try to get jobs as bankers, accountants & lawyers, probably in London. Instead, I notice many of the professionals on the forum live in far more natural, beautiful but also rather more isolated locales - the Peak District, Gower, Dartmoor, Scotland, Cumbria, N. Wales, Mid-Wales. Better places to live, I think. As Chris mentioned, having several lines of income can be important for many self employed - e.g. make/install product, write books/articles about it, make video DVDs/TV, teach others to make product, demo, make/design/promote tools, sharpen tools, teach others to make/ sharpen tools, take on an apprentice, cut/sell firewood/kindling, sell green wood (there seems to be an unsatisfied demand for green ash in my tiny village :D).

I recently came across an article about a crafts woman who has a business making sable paint brushes for artists (she employs several people) but she started out as a professional fly tyer, quite similar skills if you think about it. Possibly a similar market too - my neighbour is a keen fly fisherman, the previous owner of his house was a watercolourist. Being flexible and able to spot an opportunity/unsatisfied demand are probably useful traits.
Last edited by ToneWood on Mon Jun 25, 2012 12:59 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Who's the most succesful green woodworker you know?

Postby fish » Sat Jun 23, 2012 5:48 pm

there are many ways to mesure success,to me i recon the chap that has the least scars on his hands is the most successfull!
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Re: Who's the most succesful green woodworker you know?

Postby witt » Sat Jun 23, 2012 8:13 pm

Though I have included in this thread an introduction to a bit of theory that was intended to guide people to the nearest approach that I can remember as a combination of ecology-liberty-authenticity-simplicity-happiness- ; I was not bashful about saying where the truth lies.
I've never been able to believe whole-heartedly, in any profound sense, in connecting our experience of the self with the outer world.
The oneness of the Being and the objects of the world is a doctrine for which there is no adequate evidence.

But, for my part, I can't cut me off from this facile illusion. Otherwise it leads me to a desolate solitude.
So I have thought. I wanted to give an important example : people by their persistance contribute to establish an aesthetic of life. Most of our fellows here on this forum not only desire their own happiness but also unify the world on speculating for a more suitable evolution. I find myself deeply in agreement with the good things for which they are fighting - i figure among them a form of liberty- and I see them constantly frightened by the possibilities of the capitalist alteration of the World.
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Re: Who's the most succesful green woodworker you know?

Postby ToneWood » Sat Jun 23, 2012 10:06 pm

How about Ben Law, the chap featured on Grand Designs TV show & now author? http://www.ben-law.co.uk/
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Re: Who's the most succesful green woodworker you know?

Postby robin wood » Sun Jun 24, 2012 1:49 am

ToneWood wrote:How about Ben Law, the chap featured on Grand Designs TV show & now author? http://www.ben-law.co.uk/


Well again depends on how you measure success. If we are asking who has succeeded at making a living from making and selling green wood products then I would rule out the folk that make a large part of their living from writing, teaching etc. Teaching green woodworking or writing about it is great but it is a very different thing to actually doing it. There are also a number of businesses that rely on a heavy input of free voluntary input, again nothing wrong with that but I think those businesses that are viable in the 21st century actually making and selling things are particularly interesting.
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Re: Who's the most succesful green woodworker you know?

Postby witt » Sun Jun 24, 2012 9:10 am

Success here should be mesured from the inside.
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Re: Who's the most succesful green woodworker you know?

Postby robin wood » Sun Jun 24, 2012 11:18 am

witt wrote:Success here should be mesured from the inside.


I once heard it said that inner happiness comes when there is little distance between what we believe and what we do. I suspect many green woodworkers score pretty well on that.
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Re: Who's the most succesful green woodworker you know?

Postby witt » Sun Jun 24, 2012 2:49 pm

That is a difficult one, Robin.
I think (not certain) it's an extrem generalisation which starts in early greek philosophy and connects the question "what is most advisable to do with our human existence ?" with duty, and justice (as what we should value the most).
From this conception, happiness is generally promoted by obedience to recognised rules of duty (they can be laws of God or directives that one subject can prescribe to himself as how to secure ends of a peculiar nature). There is however no empirical evidence for regarding the performance of duty as a universal or infaillible mean to the attainment of happiness.
But this need further discussion. I would just draw your attention on Socrate's death, on the ability for great happiness of protestant people, and of the highly educated persons who strive for the extension of their intellect... The risk of self-deception, you see.

On the contrary, if you look around you, people who are capable of showing some respectable distance between what they do and what they beleive are less subject to self-deception. Derision reveals itself being a powerfull protective device.

On one side you have the spirit of Sidney and Beatrice Webb, on the other side the egoist light epicurism of the Bloomsburry group which adopt the equation :
Happiness = art of inter-personal relations + development of aesthetic sensibility. This is perhaps an undue simplification...
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Re: Who's the most succesful green woodworker you know?

Postby robin wood » Sun Jun 24, 2012 11:46 pm

footie was a bit crap tonight
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Re: Who's the most succesful green woodworker you know?

Postby nic » Sun Jun 24, 2012 11:57 pm

Can't stand those skinny birds, I like something to grab hold of.
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Re: Who's the most succesful green woodworker you know?

Postby ToneWood » Mon Jun 25, 2012 12:57 pm

:D You obviously didn't see the Italian player's wife featured on P3 on Saturday then.

Re. Ben Law. Appearing on TV & doing book promotions, talks, etc. might be just the sort of thing some/many green wood workers would rather not do. But they say variety is the spice of life.
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Re: Who's the most succesful green woodworker you know?

Postby witt » Mon Jun 25, 2012 7:08 pm

Soak... Soak...The worse was to come. I was about to bullshit you with William Morris. I'll turn to wooden goggles instead.
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Re: Who's the most succesful green woodworker you know?

Postby mstibs » Mon Jun 25, 2012 8:57 pm

robin wood wrote:footie was a bit crap tonight


condolences ... :?
Saxons. Were good wood-turners, they had to be because they were poor potters...from "A Short History of Woodturning with the Pole-lathe" by Brian G. Howarth; My bilingual (de/en) Blog: http://mstibs.wordpress.com
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Re: Who's the most succesful green woodworker you know?

Postby Bob_Fleet » Tue Jun 26, 2012 12:19 am

Thread degenerated so I've moved it to the "playground".
:lol:
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Re: Who's the most succesful green woodworker you know?

Postby witt » Wed Jun 27, 2012 6:00 pm

To complete my desperate struggle at the very moment everyone almost laughed, I'd like to apologize to all for being too pompous.
After having spent too long in one's head, one forgets everything about setting forth some views in a form that is rational to all and such as to be more of a practical character.

The course of the initial inquiry, in broad line and so far as my interpretation is correct, was setting a goal which our inferences would'nt have been able to reach.
Unless an effort for the emergence of a clear criterium of success had followed.
Or was-it wealth alone that was meant ? I don't think so, this restatement of the question might well have rendered the research futile. Or ?

Concepts such as success, happiness are vaguely bounded and singularly difficult to be ramified with the web of psychological concepts, outside the folk-psychological concept factory and other elements of ethics littered with debris of essential references. Mixed as they are they might reveal fundamental differences of convictions about how we ought to live if our actions were to support our beliefs. Naturally some glimpses of the construction make the ultimate problem of our actions hard to grasp.
I'll put my wooden goggles on, satisfy my natural ambition of personal enjoyment and prepare myself for a lovely time in the backyard, in peace and prosperity !
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